Last updated on 2014.02.05
Josie Weiland isn't the only South Dakota expressing disgust with the bullying, anti-civil rights Senate Bill 128. Also expressing outrage at SB 128 is Josie's uncle, Rick Weiland, who happens to be running for Senate. Here's what Uncle Rick says in this morning's press release:
...here is what I said to a joint Caucus of my party at our State Capitol just after learning of this latter day Jim Crow legislation.
"As a candidate for Federal office I normally would not weigh in on a bill in front of our State Legislature, but SB 128 is so offensive, so extreme, so potentially damaging to our state, and to every person in it, that it must be opposed."
If you are gay or lesbian, and you walk into a business run by someone who objects to your sexual orientation, you will be refused service if this bill is enacted.
Substitute the words 'gender' or 'race' for the words, 'sexual orientation,' and a bill otherwise identical to this one would legalize discrimination against African Americans, Native Americans and women [Rick Weiland, press release, 2014.02.03].
Just as outrageous as SB 128 itself is the silence of Weiland's Senate campaign opponents on this effort to cloak rank discrimination and bigotry in Christian faith:
Incredibly, at least two of my five Republican opponents for South Dakota's United States Senate seat support this terrible legislation, and the other three, as of this writing, have made no comment about it despite my specific public request that they do so [Weiland, 2014.02.03].
Josie, if your friends are mad about Senate Bill 128, you'd better tell them to get down to the courthouse, register to vote, and come out in November to vote for your uncle Rick and all the other Democrats who will defend everyone's civil rights.
And the one is a co-sponsor who has some answering to do.
Weiland's wrong. Jim Crow was "separate but equal". SB 192 is "don't force me to bake a gay cake."
Thad, you need to read up on Jim Crow. The Citizen's Council is alive and well in SD!
This is bill sad, but it is also very stupid. Looking at our recent history, South Dakotans just voted down restrictive abortion legislation… twice! And I would like to think the sanctity of life ranks a lot higher on people's agendas than this bill reaffirming their right to hate. If this were law, would business owners then think they could just use this to discriminate against anyone, and just say, "I thought he was gay"? The ironic thing is that I wonder how many times skinny little high school speech student Ried Holien (a co-sponsor of SB128) was referred to as "gay" by the Watertown jocks. Just because someone says something, doesn't make it true. But being thrown out of a cafe owned by one of the jock's fathers would add a lot more credence to the rumors, wouldn't it?
I've met Rick Weiland twice now and come away very impressed with his dedication and intelligence. I'm also on his email list and have found that his words are eloquent and thoughtful.
I asked him last Friday when he was in Pierre if he wrote his last piece on the Lily Ledbetter law himself. He did. This guy is the real thing and isn't relying on speech writers to get his message across.
For West Wing fans, I feel like Josh coming back from New Hampshire and standing outside Sam's conference room to let him know "This guy's for real."
Jana,
What was once called "The White Citizens Council" of Dixie, is now called "The Republican Party of South Dakota".
Not only is SB128 hateful and bigoted, like Mr. Weiland stated, it is very similar to Jim Crow. The real problem with legislation like SB128 is that it opens the door to additional amendments to legalize discrimination against other American citizens.
I'm old to remember coming to Rapid City from the reservation for monthly shopping trips and seeing those proudly displayed signs that said "No Dogs or Indians Allowed". SB128 opens that door again.
In fact, in a morbid sort of way, SB128 should pass and it should require capitalist to post Jim Crow signs. If the hate crowd had any courage at all they would post the signs so citizens know who they are.
Just as the KKK hid behind bed sheets, racist and prejudice business owners hope to hide behind SB128.
The only difference between Jim Crow laws in the south and here in South Dakota is that many retailers and services recognized the need for Black dollars, they would gladly take their dollars, but literally wash the money to prevent contamination.
"...here is what I said to a joint Caucus of my party at our State Capitol just after learning of this latter day Jim Crow legislation."
Thank you Rick Weiland for echoing my sentiments on this horrible piece of legislation. If the George Orwell Party doesn't want people to call them bigots, then they need to stop introducing bills like this.
There is the opposite problem, too. Lots of straight people in Madison, WI, including a couple of my younger co-workers, go to gay bars (they are straight). They call it "clubbing." I guess there are other clubs in town catering to everybody, but I'm told the "gay" clubs have a freer vibe and the sort of dance music they like. It's definitely not for me, but not because of the gays. It's the loud, pulsing music I don't much care for.
Anyway, the straight folks invading the gay scene has pissed off a few gay folks who want a place to themselves. What happens is they go start a new place for gays, and it becomes the happenin' place, and then the straight folks invade. Repeat repeatedly.
So, the solution is if you want to not cater to gays, start a business that caters to gays. It will become the happenin' place to go, the straights will invade and drive the gays out. Simple, and no Jim Crow laws needed.
So if SB128 passes I wonder if we will eventually see signs go up at business windows "Only White Christians Allowed"? I wonder how they would know I'm a Christian? How do I prove it? Recite verses from the bible? A secret handshake? I'm seen and known to go to an approved church? Verify I'm white?
SD retail is starving and it is complete and utter BS to say retailers are looking for ways to keep any race, religion or sexual preference out. There maybe other intentions as Donald stated, but it is not SD retail denying any part of an already small customer base.
.
While Jenny is boycotting our state instead of the anti gay biz, and racial biz bigots, make sure she knows the preference of the online and local markets she uses. Because of a few misfits in our state she chooses to try and broadcast to the country how SD is racist and not accepting sexual preference. I've lived in Mn and there is every stereotype there she is predicating onto SD.
.
I spend time in the middle of the tourist industry, it is probably the most liberal group of folks in SD she is going after with her boycotts. Go Jenny!
.
I think the bill itself was bigoted and stupid, but I also think business owners should not be forced to take any and all customers. My mom was a florist and there are always customers who are more trouble than they are worth. Just watch a few episodes of Bridezillas and you will see hairdressers and dressmakers reduced to tears. Nobody should be forced to work with customers like that. These vendors should be able to get out of their contracts simply by refunding the deposits. They shouldn't have to worry about getting sued. They shouldn't have to go to court and explain that they didn't want to cancel the contract because of the couple's sexual orientation, they wanted to cancel because the bride was obnoxious. Nobody should have to put up with that.
mooooo.
We should be able to picket during Mass at any Cathedral using twitter to build flash mobs.
Brian's a big talker. Just what you Dems need, more chicken spit Democrats in Pierre. This should be labeled, " five crazy Republicans."
.
EB5 could be labeled the whole damn GOP in Pierre. But, it can't because there isn't but a handful of Dems with enough guts to stand, talk, and separate themselves from the mess. Your party has the women doing the talking, with the party leaders if you can call them that, peeking out from behind their skirts. They could have the whole scandal in notes and no guts to use it.
.
The ag bill is a couple aisles over "Lar". Shape shiftin again?
The anti-civil rights crowd wants the safety perimeter around medical facilities to be lowered so we should be able to protest church crimes during Mass.
Anne-- A person who is involved in the wedding industry that doesn't think they should have to put up with fussy brides is akin to a dog groomer who doesn't think they should have to put up with barking dogs-- Just sayin
And what is the point of contract law if you can get out of a contract by merely stating that the contractee was a pain in the arse?
I've mentioned this before but this SB128 is totally over the top and is not needed. If I felt discriminated and I have indeed been discriminated I simply treated them as any other place where they provided terrible service or a product. It all depends on the situation. If I really wanted to have a working relationship with that business I'd find a supervisor or just go up the chain of command yet be tactful to try and mutually resolve this since I may value what they offer and they value my business.
If there was no chance for resolution and I'm talking to a brick wall in as far as attitudes I would never shop there again and make sure to spread the word. Just like many businesses you rarely ever get compliments but you definitely hear complaints and it's an opportunity to fix things and regain business.
I've been situations though rare where I would simply politely turn away customers that I dealt with before. It had nothing to do with race, religion, sexual orientation or anything. They would be relentless in negotiations drawing it out for hours and days and I could not make any money with all the time and energy spent. There were customers where horse trading was sport and that's ok but those very few customers I turned away was to the extreme.
Likely if someone is obnoxious and rude to a business owner they have the right to refuse business. Besides being very disrespectful it can disrupt the business atmosphere making other customers uncomfortable.
Throwing a lawsuit at a business is the last thing I'd want to do It would not even be on my radar for options. I would imagine those circumstances are very rare yet we have SB 128 which again I stress is a waste of time for our legislators and all of us concerned. There are far more "real" issues that need to be addressed during this legislative session.
Yes, this bill is crapola.
Les, I have a specific question for you:
You said In regard to the Democratic Party, "Your party has the women doing the talking, with the party leaders if you can call them that, peeking out from behind their skirts."
Read it again. Think about what you clearly and directly said.
Yes, that's it. If the women of the party are taking the lead, that is a clear indication that the men are not the dominant leaders that they should be. If women are leading, there is obviously something wrong.
Oh Les. That was your knee-jerk response, wasn't it? I hope it came from old habit, rather than heartfelt belief. If it was the latter, you have soundly reinforced a Republican stereotype.
Your comment comes at an interesting time Les. The Olympics begin this Friday. This is the first year the Men who have always controlled the Olympics, are allowing women to compete in ski jumping. A lot of convincing was required because they were afraid it might hurt women's uteruses! Sigh.
There are still sports women are not Allowed to compete in because the poor little things might get hurt. We all know women can't cope with pain. And they get too flustered; they're too excitable and emotional to be in charge of anything. That's the big, strong man's job.
Les, this is not all directed at you. Our SD legislature has tried to put into effect many anti-choice laws. They couched the perceived need for such laws in care taking language. Pregnant women confronted by a pregnancy decision, needs help via the Republican legislature's men. So they need to be shown an ultrasound image so they realize there is actually a blastocyst or fetus inside their body. They must be required to wait for several days so they have time to calm down and think about it.
Double sigh.
This rant didn't even feel good. Well, whatever you readers do, don't take this comment seriously. I know you realize it came from an emotional, excitable woman. (Maybe it's 'my time of the month!')
Les,
Geez, where do I start.
In case you haven't noticed, Rick Weiland is a man speaking out against SB128 and there are many more. Your suggestion that anyone is hiding behind a woman's skirt is as appalling as SB128 itself.
Democratic women leaders are a part of the charge to defeat this bill and should be respected for their vocal opposition, who better understands bigotry than South Dakota women. It is called equality Les, women's voices are just as important as yours.
Many Republicans have stated their opposition to SB128, calling it stupid, irresponsible, etc., but support a business' right to practice discrimination without any threat of legal ramifications. In other words, "I Support Bigotry", you can not have it both ways
So, Anne, you are a member of the Holy Spirit Parish: when would be a good time to flash mob a service?
A cake can be gay? Gosh, I learn something new everyday.
Rick,
Gay cake. Wonder where Stace Nelson can order an anti-gay cake.
I would like to order a straight anti-straight cake.
Mr. Pay, you and I finally agree on something.
Loud pulsing music will drive a man insaner than most.
Oregon is considering a similar law. In addition, the article mentions the bill we're talking about here.
Give it a read.
http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSBREA1106Z20140202?irpc=932
I'm about your age and say every day is my time of the month, Deb, LOL, don't fret it. I have a daughter dominating in a male world of a national company.
.
The picture in my mind while writing was of scared boys behind their mothers skirt, it obviously didn't pen that way, maybe a sanctimonious platitude?
.
I'm hoping for a person, regardless of any of the controversial characteristics, with the guts, brains and honor to challenge the problems at all levels. There are few elected stepping forth and those who do regardless of party need support.
.
Beyond that, as Oprah say, some are just going to have to die for change to come, as surely we will.
.
Roger, my only comment to you. An old Indian friend Ray, stopped by and woke me about a week ago. I said something about his few words and he replied, "Les, Indian with his mouth open all the time suffocates on his own words". True for me to Roger. When I'm replying to Roger this often, my mouth runneth over.
Larry, here's something about flash mobs and Roman Catholic mass.
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/mass-mobs-fill-pews-lift-prayers-ny-churches
Rewild the West. Statehood for the tribes and Mexico.
Sigh #3. Les, Les, Les.
"Deb, LOL, don't fret it." I'm glad you have a daughter who can dominate. Good for her. This is something that women and men, especially those with children, ought to "fret" about.
Do you understand what I'm talking about? Do you understand that your choice of insult to the Democrats was to describe them as less than women? If it's bad for them to be less than women, where does that leave women?
There is a commercial for AFLAC insurance that takes place in a locker room. The coach is clearly unhappy with his team. He says to them, "All right ladies . . . !" Do you get that? "Ladies" is an insult.
You see, as far as worth/value/ability and any other metric one might use, I think men deserve to be up there on the same level as women.
Mexican statehood for the tribes indeed!
Lyman Pretty Weasel, his mouth stuffed full of dirt.
Here is more national coverage. There we are, alongside Tennessee, Texas, Kansas, Idaho.
http://brianpellot.religionnews.com/2014/02/03/religious-freedom-blasphemy-football-tunisia-indonesia-gay-quenelle-school/
Is there a reading comprehension problem tonite? You, me, Roger?
.
The don't fret it came after my comment on a time of the month statement. No prob to me if it is or isn't, go for it.
.
As for the rest of your comment, explain how I continued to devalue women? I explained my intent. Are children hiding behind mothers dresses somehow denigrating the woman?
.
If you re read my original quote, it was mostly about EB5, a nuclear issue, which you would sideline for a minute of literary policing victory.
All right Les. I give up. You've gone around and around the issue. It's clearly just not important to you. So be it.
Les,
In today's RCJ, national journalist Charles Krauthammer had an article about how the Republican Party can counter the war on women. In it he suggests that GOP leadership and conservative commentators stop saying stupid things about women. Read the article and take his advice.
Les, sometimes I think you are clueless, really. You may think you stand for equality but at the same time you are so institutionalized with Republican and "Christian" beliefs it escapes you.
Equality is women and men speaking to issues that concern them with an equal voice, it is simple. "Hiding behind women's skirts" is an archaic meaningless phrase, I have great admiration for women that stand up to the Les's of the world, they usually offer a point of view that I did consider or is totally different, It should be considered refreshing.
Your Indian friend is right, however it does not just apply to Indians.
I actually like this a little better, "Les is more".
EB-5 is never off my radar as much as Republicans would like it to be with their continued cover up over the scandal and look forward to whatever Cory discovers in the future.
Deb,
Often times when Republicans say something dumb about women, their explanations and justifications become the entertainment.
Spit, sputter, cough, followed by "that's not what I meant" or "you took my words out of context" You know the routine.
Thank you Roger. I do appreciate your support, understanding and encouragement. The thing is, there are many men like you. Because such gentlemen are reasonable and thoughtful, they don't get the attention the ignorant blowhards do.
Thanks again. Those of us who endure discrimination help hold one another up.
Make sure you let Bernie and the gang know, Cory is in charge of heading up the EB5 investigation Rog..
.
Clueless? I think if any of us had a clue of all the problems, we would run for the woods.
.
I will stop saying stupid things once I quit saying anything, as you will also Roger.
Deb,
Thanks are not necessary. Equality for me is way of life, I live it, it is my freedom.
When we all understand that and practice it, even the blowhards, they too will know what freedom is.
Les,
Who's Bernie? I'm sure Cory will be surprised to learn he's heading up the EB-5 investigation, wish he were, there would probably be a bunch of Republicans in prison right now.
I don't know that I say stupid things Les, simply because you don't comprehend what I'm talking about does not make me stupid.
Roger Cornelius, an informed SD Dem who doesn't say anything stupid. "Who's Bernie?" Well, not stupid, just uninformed. You'll figure it out. Night Rog.
.
When this blog becomes less about implied conceptual semantics and more about dealing with problems essential to the immediate survival of our state, the Democrats may start to achieve partisan unity.
Bipartisan unity
Discrimination based on gender, race, sexual orientation, etc., is not an essential problem for SD?
Then why don't Republicans stop writing discriminatory bills and work on the Real essential problems?
I guess the take away from a generally gay tolerant city is that if you are an intolerant gay-hating fascist business person you have the problem that no one wants to patronize you because of who you are. If you are an intolerant straight-hating fascist business person you have the problem that the straight people you hate want to patronize your emporium because of who you are. Either way, intolerance is losing out to market forces.
It would be great for South Dakota to deal with these problems that Les sees.
The South Dakota Republican Legislature has had only about four decades to solve all these monumental problems. Let's give them the time they need.
The fix is in, legalize discrimination, launch a 2nd Amendment argument, throw fetuses in there too, and other stupidity and the Rounds/Daugaard/GOED/EB-5/NBP/Jackley scandal will magically disappear.
Les@"This should be labeled, " five crazy Republicans."
.
Psychoanalyze them Deb. I didn't write the bill.
Now Roger has a come to Jesus, seen the light moment!
What if someone who owned a bakery was forced to make a cake for a group they were totally against; a burning cross cake for the KKK? Or the NRA wanted a big cake with guns on it, which read, "Guns save lives!" Or what if you owned a hotel and the NAMBLA organization wanted to have a convention there? I know, probably very dumb and extreme examples. But should a bakery/other people really be forced to have to have to do business with people or groups which go against their ideals? And I am not trying to compare gays to the KKK or NAMBLA; I am just thinking what could happen down the road if you aren't careful how some of these laws are written.
Les, you have it wrong, again. Roger didn't have a come to Jesus moment, if Jesus wants to talk, he can come to me.
Les, if you go to change.org you can the sign the petition against SB128.
Les, if an issue like SB128 is dominating social media for a day or two, it does mean that any has lost focus of other pressing issues. It's called multi-tasking, a lot of people do it.
Anne, there's an old movie line that echoes in my head during this debate: "We reserve the right to refuse service to a--h---s like you!" If a customer is behaving like a jerk, if the customer's behavior is getting in the way of conducting normal business, the business owner has the right to cancel the transaction and tell the customer to beat it.
Can we draw a line between denying service to individual customers because of what they do and denying service to entire classes of customers because of who they are?
Don makes a good point about how intolerance affects business. Big businesses, with a few exceptions of Kochs and Walton's, is strongly in favor of equal rights for all. Cargill, General Mills, Target, Best Buy, 3M, United Healthcare, Wells Fargo, etc., etc., etc., all vigorously supported MN's marriage equality law. They contributed money, CEOs wrote letters to the editor, etc.
Intolerance and discrimination are bad for business.
Some Republican legislators voted for marriage equality, in part because supporters of equality promised they'd help fundraise for the next election. The next election is this year. At this time those legislators have raised more than twice as much money as they had last time. Voting for equality can pay political dividends.
The less discrimination, the better businesses can recruit. Equality is good business.
Paula, those aren't dumb examples. They are worth exploring. Let me step toward the discrimination threshold by proposing a series of situations where all Baker Bob knows is the given information. In which situations can he justify refusing to do business?
(1) Bob makes cakes. Some guy named Joe orders a cake.
(2) Flamingly gay Serge walks into Bob's bakery and orders a cake. Bob asks, "What are you gonna use it for?" Serge replies, "I'm going to eat it!"
(3) Joe and Serge walk in together the next day and order a cake. They say they're throwing a birthday party.
(4) Joe and Serge walk in holding hands and order a cake.
(5) Joe and Serge walk in holding hands and order a cake decorated to say, "Happy Anniversary Mom and Dad!"
(6) Joe and Serge walk in holding hands and order a cake decorated to say, "Happy Anniversary Mom-1 and Mom-2!"
(7) Joe and Serge walk in holding hands and order a cake designed to look like two gay men engaged in sexual activity.
Good Cory! I think #7 just might be out of line.
Actually, I think it's not the baker's business what a customer wants the cake for. Maybe he ought to have a questionnaire for customers to fill out. You know, a pre-order requirement. Online too.
If a baker is asked to make a cake for the klan,it does not mean he condones the klan if he bakes it. It is just a part of doing regular business. If the klan started hanging around the bakery,that could be a perception problem. These bills seem like wingnut,CINOS attempts to let non wingnuts know that they are slightly inferior and that phony christian beliefs trump everyone else's beliefs.
I believe the seperate but equal case was Plessy v Ferguson-1896 and I could be wrong.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/163/537
Plessy v Ferguson
I think the cake bakery would be able to refuse to bake the KKK cake because the KKK is not a protected class. I might be wrong and if anyone has a court case to cite as precedence I'd sure like to see it. Arguments without court precedence carry much less weight.
Note that any analogy to the Klan here requires stating that being gay is as socially destructive and morally reprehensible as wanting to lynch blacks and Catholics and drive them out of the country. Accepting SB 128 actually means deeming homosexuals a greater threat to society than the Klan, since the sponsors are protecting the rights of those who would discriminate against gays but not those who would reverse-boycott white supremacist customers.
A disabled vet, rolled into a motel owned by a relative 10 or so years back. The line to register held a half dozen or so folks ahead of him. After a few minutes of waiting, he started yelling discrimination. The desk clerk felt bad and stated, how may we help you, a free night or weekend? No the vet replied, I want a month. Many deserve equality. This vet got a month due to a lawsuit fear. Unfortunately this vet represents a group who truly deserves.
.
Who decides what is most morally or socially destructive to society Cory? If each group didn't have a voice, it wouldn't be heard and you can bet the KKK had and prob still does have a voice. The traditional family continues to fail, is not a noise maker like many and loses ground with every change.
Les, your story, if true, shows how poorly people, even those in business, understand the disability laws. If the facts are as you state the disabled vet had no basis for a suit and your relative had an entire line full of witnesses to back her up that in fact no discrimination had in fact happened. She caved for no reason.
The so called "traditional family" has been on the decline for years and homosexuals had nothing to do with it. Teenaged pregnancies are a factor and if they have risen it is due in part to the rotten state of sex education and the difficulty teenagers have getting contraceptives. Much of the blame for that rests squarely on the shoulders of the Christian Right.
The clerk was not illiterate one here on disability issues Nick, he understood, an attorney for even a frivolous suit would outweigh most demands.
.
Difficulty with contraceptives Nick? If true Nick, you must mean mommie didn't pack them in the lunch box? Who didn't have the pill starting in the 60's? There were free clinics scattered across every city.
.
The Christian Right was in your home denying you the right to educate your own children and you allowed them?
.
Nick, your parenting shortcomings are not my problem, nor my responsibility.
Careful, Nick! Teen pregnancy is down!
DB, I'm not sure what you're implying about Grandma and Grandpa Nemec, but I don't like the smell of it.
Les, are you saying civil rights protections for folks with disabilities do more harm than good? Your relative should have stood on the facts. The vet had no case and would have lost. A long line is not a civil rights violation. Telling gays a class that you won't serve them is.
What,praytell,is a "trditional family"? Is it a white,christian mom and dad with 2.1 children and an income of $40k? Or is it whatever it happens to be at any given time. Many of us do not feel the need to be subjugated to phony christian ideals or conservative plans we don't feel obligated to believe. You'd have a hard time making the first American settlers that your ides of tradition is the one they have to accept.
Tort reform, not disability issue Cory. Motel room 70% occupancy rate at $1200 for a month. Find me an attorney that will leave his office for $1200 Cory.
.
interested party is creepy and should be banned.
Fine, but SB 128 ain't tort reform any more than it is anti-bullying legislation.
fascinating.
Exactly mike from Iowa. Growing up, those so-called traditional christian families had the kids that were the biggest bullies in school. Those traditional parents were the ones who refused to believe their kid could do no wrong. The catholics - those kids were the worst, and the Catholic church is partly responsible for teen pregnancy rates with their archaic stances on contraception and gays. The Catholic church has produced a bunch of messed up adults from the priests who abused them.
Who said sb128 was anything but crazy Cory?
Free month? Was the guy homeless?
Jenny@"Those traditional parents were the ones who refused to believe their kid could do no wrong. ". I agree Jenny! my father and mother refused to believe I could do no wrong and subsequently held my nose to the grindstone and the belt near my ass.
.
As for the Catholics, there isn't another religion without issues most likely similar percentages. None are to be held without contempt for their errors.
Gee Jenny, way to generalize Christian families! My family happens to be a "traditional christian" family somewhat by the definition someone posted here, but I really don't believe my kids are bullies. And believe me, they are far from perfect. Most kids who are bullies have "parents" who are bullies, Christian or not. I really take offense to your statement of Christian families. I don't believe I, or my kids, are any better than anyone else.
Does a disabled vet need to be homeless to find comfort in my home or a hotel room for a month Jim? Did he stay a month? I only know the story my uncle told me. His group was a partnership in over a dozen motels from Texas to Minnesota and I know disability issues were front and central in their policy.
See that's the common misconception, Paula. There are kids who are angels in front of the parents and teachers. Take them away from the adults and then they show their true colors. Trust me, I know. These were the kids who were the teacher's pets, but treated the kids who were a little different like dirt. It happens with adults also, bullying never really goes away. The brownnoser to the supervisor at work? Watch out for him. Truth of the matter, some people are just not good human beings.
So what does that have to do with having Christian values or upbringing (in your last post)?
The bullies to me growing up were the ones from traditional christian familes (mostly Catholic). The ones that pranced to communion every Sunday, not thinking or caring how they had just treated me or my brothers and sisters. That's why I bring up bullying, and it is christians (though they aren't in my book to bring up such a bill) who are sponsoring sb 128 which is a bullying mean-spirited bill in every way! Yes, this is why I call myself a recovering Catholic. I have been hurt by religion.
And here I thought it was Republicans bringing this bill, Jenny. So it's a Christian thing? There is a song that goes something like, "we will know they are Christians by their love." Not their words Jen!
.
In my town it was the Catholics that were bullied.
.
Poor poor, pitiful me. Another song Jen.
I'm not sure there is a correlation between who the bullies are and what religion they practice. Every person who is bullied has their own story. Stereotyping doesn't help solve the problem.
But there definitely is a correlation between hypocrites and people that claim to be christians but don't follow the mantra of love and acceptance.
I can see Les' point,or at least I think it is his point. One months free stay is less costly than going to court with or without a lawyer. However if one gets away with this non-sense,others may try. I agree with Cory that the bustard didn't have a case and would have lost in most normal jurisdictions. I also see in SD where the courts back state officials and there is that chance that the defendant would face a hostile judiciary. I am disabled and a flaming,bleeding heart,Ind. lib and I don't ask for special treatment. It took over thirty years and numerous back operations before I got disability. Under dumb bass dubya nearly every disability claim was denied.
Les and Nick, that's why I don't claim to be the christian. I wouldn't really be able to live with my hypocrisy! I would fall into the throes of paranoia, not living up to myself to what a true christian really is. I'm more at peace as an agnostic.
"What,praytell,is a "trditional family"? Is it a white,christian mom and dad with 2.1 children and an income of $40k?"-Mike from Iowa
Mike from Iowa has hit on something here. The Tea Party wants to go back to what I call White Bread America. In this America (which I doubt ever really existed, but we'll play along), everyone lives in neat little cookie-cutter suburbs with a two car garage and a white picket fence. Those pesky minorities (blacks, Hispanics, etc) were neatly tucked away in inter-city housing projects where they couldn't upset the apple cart of suburbia. Unless, of course, they were needed to dig ditches or scrub toilets or trim the hedges or.....well, you get the idea. The man goes to work and the women (unless they wanted to be a nurse, teacher or secretary) stayed home and took care of the house and kids. Women knew their place and stayed there and father ALWAYS knew best. This is what the Tea Party pines for and this is what drives their anger and resentment towards anyone that doesn't think the exact same way.
The Winter Olympics in Russia will be starting in a few days, many will be watching not just the talented Olympians, they will be paying attention to Russia and Vladmir Putin's rigid stance on gays.
While Russia's laws regarding gays and lesbians is unusually cruel, South Dakota own Stace Nelson and other co-sponsors of SB128 and are not far behind.
SB128 is merely a stepping stone to other legislation legalizing discrimination. What is their next piece of legislation restricting rights or criminalizing LGBT lifestyles? Their agenda is not done whether SB128 passes or not.
Jenny I was sentenced to a Catholic school and it was a culture shock coming from public school. My first year there my teacher/drill instructor/nun ran it like a military academy. The only thing is that from grade school thru high school it was never a safe environment with all the peer abuse and bullying going on. One of the boys I'd be surprised if he was ever fertile having to go to the hospital after repeatedly being kicked in the groin. There was so much violence and other forms of abuse. The administration looked the other way since these kids came from prominent large Catholic families where if the abusers would have gone to public school they would have been expelled. I feel bad for my parent since they sacrificed to send us kids there and they realize it was a waste of money and I would have had a better environment to learn at the public school.
These parents of the abusers never claimed to be Christians or anything like that but something must have caused those abusers a great deal of pain to be so unhappy and inflict their pain on others. I don't know. If your at peace with yourself and fairly happy why would you ever wish to inflict harm on others?
Our class was the last of the big Catholic family graduating classes yet it never really gets together for reunions compared to the other classes and it's probably due to what happened when we were there.
I wouldn't generalize and blame it on Catholics or Christians in this case since I've seen terrible behavior from such a diverse group growing up.
I remember etched in stone above the entry way of our Catholic School "Suffer thy Children" We definitely suffered! lol
Thumbs up to Brian. There are many conservative-types that really want to turn back the clock on social issues.
@Brian, good description. Maybe those folks watched too much Leave it to Beaver and Father Knows Best and believed that is the way life was supposed to be. I sometimes think those folks are very angry with life when they found out reality is far from the TV shows. (I put up a white picket fence for the iron of it all.)
OT-US Senate passed farm bill. On its way to Obama. Don't know if he will sign it or veto it.
I hope the President signs the Farm Bill. It is so crucial to the economy of farm states like the Dakotas, Minnesota, Nebraska, etc.
That was a very apt description Brian. The 1950s is the "rose-colored-glasses" decade of a large percentage of white male conservatives.
As people age, perceptions of the past often change. It's a common and known experience. Remaining in reality requires an ongoing awareness of that. Good memories are more pleasant to have, but significantly less accurate. There are aspects of my youth I'd like to reexperience, but that would require forcing the population to change to suit my wishes.
Seriously, isn't that just nuts!?
Lynn, why am I not surprised that there would be a "suffer thy children" sign above the entryway to a catholic school! :(
Nice touch Roger.
Pointing out the similarities between Jensen, Begalka, Kopp, May, Nelson, Olson, Qualm, Wick, Russell, Steele and Campbell and Vladimir Putin.
Hey, don't the terrorists hate gays too? And the Axis of Evil?
Good company gang.
Maybe a better name for SB128 would be Putin's128
This 1.2.8 business will be the end of Messrs. Jensen and Holien. The rest of the crazies on that law are already insaner than most, but those two fellows will get their walking papers over this.
grudznick will even help write letters to the editors. When people put their names on this kind of Sibesquetuteness they always get their walking papers.
What were these fellows thinking?